Mike, Jimmy, Chris, Noam, Todd:

1:51 PM
Mike Mintz added trbdavies to this conversation
Jimmy Tobin 1:51 PM
yes
Noam Ben-Avi 1:51 PM
sweet
1:51 PM
can u get chris also
Chris Beachy 1:51 PM
here
Noam Ben-Avi 1:51 PM
double sweet
Chris Beachy 1:52 PM
deme team. assemble!
Mike Mintz 1:52 PM
haha
1:52 PM
todd are you here?
Jimmy Tobin 1:53 PM
ooo event looks great!
Noam Ben-Avi 1:53 PM
the event viewer is up now?
Jimmy Tobin 1:54 PM
..maybe
1:54 PM
i'm making an event right now
1:54 PM
lemme do that
Mike Mintz 1:54 PM
can someone see if todd is around?
Jimmy Tobin 1:54 PM
got him
Noam Ben-Avi 1:55 PM
wait Mike, kind of a problem
1:55 PM
after that pull
1:55 PM
my local copy is acting up
1:55 PM
with files i have never touched
1:55 PM
Environment:

Request Method: GET
Request URL: http://127.0.0.1:8000/
Django Version: 1.2.5
Python Version: 2.6.1
Installed Applications:
['django.contrib.sessions',
'south',
'deme_django.cms',
'deme_django.modules.codegraph',
'deme_django.modules.demeaccount',
'deme_django.modules.event',
'deme_django.modules.imagedocument',
'deme_django.modules.newsroll',
'deme_django.modules.openid',
'deme_django.modules.symsys',
'deme_django.modules.webauth']
Installed Middleware:
('django.middleware.common.CommonMiddleware',
'django.contrib.sessions.middleware.SessionMiddleware',
'django.middleware.doc.XViewMiddleware',
'django.middleware.transaction.TransactionMiddleware')


Traceback:
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/core/handlers/base.py" in get_response
100. response = callback(request, *callback_args, **callback_kwargs)
File "/Users/nblazer201/Development_Noam/deme/deme/deme_django/../deme_django/cms/dispatcher.py" in alias_view
73. cur_site = get_current_site(request)
File "/Users/nblazer201/Development_Noam/deme/deme/deme_django/cms/base_viewer.py" in get_current_site
72. return Site.objects.filter(hostname=hostname).get()
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/models/query.py" in get
342. num = len(clone)
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/models/query.py" in __len__
80. self._result_cache = list(self.iterator())
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/models/query.py" in iterator
271. for row in compiler.results_iter():
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/models/sql/compiler.py" in results_iter
677. for rows in self.execute_sql(MULTI):
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/models/sql/compiler.py" in execute_sql
732. cursor.execute(sql, params)
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/backends/util.py" in execute
15. return self.cursor.execute(sql, params)
File "/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/django/db/backends/postgresql_psycopg2/base.py" in execute
44. return self.cursor.execute(query, args)

Exception Type: DatabaseError at /
Exception Value: column cms_item.email_list_address does not exist
LINE 1: ...item"."description", "cms_item"."default_viewer", "cms_item"...
^
1:56 PM
it was working this morning
Mike Mintz 1:56 PM
so i made changes to the model
1:56 PM
you'll want to run ./manage.py migrate
1:56 PM
that will migrate the database
1:56 PM
you should do that after a git pull in general, no harm if there weren't any changes
Noam Ben-Avi 1:56 PM
ok solid
Mike Mintz 1:56 PM
although you'll notice if models.py changes when you do git pull
1:57 PM
okay, so i am going to create unix accounts for all of you
1:57 PM
let me know what username you would like
trbdavies 1:57 PM
here
Mike Mintz 1:57 PM
hi Todd
Noam Ben-Avi 1:57 PM
nbenavi
trbdavies 1:58 PM
Mike you wanted to talk to me?
Mike Mintz 1:58 PM
oh, i just wanted to make sure your skype was working, nothing in particular
trbdavies 1:58 PM
ok
Noam Ben-Avi 1:59 PM
ok nice the migrate fixed everything
Chris Beachy 1:59 PM
hey
Mike Mintz 1:59 PM
okay try to ssh to nbenavi@deme.stanford.edu
1:59 PM
password: deme123
2:00 PM
(you should change that, with the passwd command)
2:00 PM
Chris and Jimmy what would you like your unix username to be?
Chris Beachy 2:00 PM
cbeachy
Jimmy Tobin 2:00 PM
jtobin1
Noam Ben-Avi 2:00 PM
nice i am in
Mike Mintz 2:01 PM
okay you all have accounts
2:01 PM
everyone try to login over ssh, password deme123, and change your password with the passwd command once you're in
2:01 PM
for reference, I ran "sudo adduser jtobin1" if we ever have to add other users
2:02 PM
i also added all of you to the admin group in /etc/group, so you should be able to sudo
2:02 PM
try running: sudo head /var/spool/mail/root
2:03 PM
you should all have sudo access
2:03 PM
weird sometimes my msesages aren't sending over skype...
2:03 PM
are you seeing this?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:03 PM
[sudo] password for nbenavi:
From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Apr 10 22:20:21 2009
Return-Path: <>
X-Original-To: root@localhost
Delivered-To: root@localhost
Received: by deme.deme (Postfix)
id 721AA3C2F6; Fri, 10 Apr 2009 22:20:21 +0000 (UTC)
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 22:20:21 +0000 (UTC)
From: MAILER-DAEMON@deme.stanford.edu (Mail Delivery System)
Subject: Undelivered Mail Returned to Sender
To: root@localhost
Jimmy Tobin 2:03 PM
yes
Noam Ben-Avi 2:03 PM
i got that
2:03 PM
yes
Mike Mintz 2:04 PM
okay cool, so you have sudo access
Chris Beachy 2:04 PM
same
Mike Mintz 2:04 PM
Jimmy does that command work for you?
Jimmy Tobin 2:04 PM
yesh
Mike Mintz 2:04 PM
erg
2:04 PM
did you see me say "erg"?
2:04 PM
i typed it but it didn't appear on my screen
Jimmy Tobin 2:04 PM
i saw it
Mike Mintz 2:04 PM
okay weird
2:05 PM
okay, so if you ever want to make changes to the actual deployment of deme.stanford.edu
2:05 PM
the important stuff is in /var/www/deme
2:05 PM
for example, if you'd like to push a change, you'd do this:
2:05 PM
cd /var/www/deme/deme_django
2:05 PM
sudo -u www-data git pull
2:05 PM
(always run as www-data so the files are owned by the apache user)
2:06 PM
and that should do it for view changes
2:06 PM
if you made model changes, you may have to migrate
Noam Ben-Avi 2:06 PM
wait so with that sudo
Mike Mintz 2:06 PM
probably with sudo -u www-data ./manage.py migrate
Noam Ben-Avi 2:06 PM
its a pull
Mike Mintz 2:06 PM
sudo -u www-data does something as user www-data
Noam Ben-Avi 2:06 PM
and then do we have to update the site with anything but migrate?
Mike Mintz 2:06 PM
i made an alias at the end of my .profile:

alias wdo="sudo -u www-data"
2:06 PM
so i just do wdo git pull
2:06 PM
brb phone
Noam Ben-Avi 2:06 PM
kk
Jimmy Tobin 2:07 PM
hey noam
2:07 PM
how you doin?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:07 PM
pretty good
2:07 PM
are u in the site ?
Jimmy Tobin 2:07 PM
i'm all up in the site
2:08 PM
don't know what i'm really doing here
Mike Mintz 2:08 PM
back
Noam Ben-Avi 2:08 PM
ok so
2:08 PM
ure in the
2:08 PM
jtobin@deme:~$ in terminal right?
Jimmy Tobin 2:08 PM
mmhmm
Noam Ben-Avi 2:08 PM
do cd /var/www/deme/deme_django/
2:08 PM
and then ls
2:09 PM
and stuff should look familiar
Jimmy Tobin 2:09 PM
gots that too
Noam Ben-Avi 2:09 PM
so pretty much thats like the real copy of what we work on
Jimmy Tobin 2:09 PM
ahhh
2:09 PM
yes
Noam Ben-Avi 2:09 PM
so like when we do stuff its testing
2:09 PM
then when we are ready
Jimmy Tobin 2:09 PM
no i gots it now
Noam Ben-Avi 2:09 PM
ah kk
Jimmy Tobin 2:09 PM
just pull
Noam Ben-Avi 2:09 PM
yup exactamundo
Mike Mintz 2:09 PM
oh i forgot to mention
2:09 PM
sometimes you'll have to restart apache
2:09 PM
generally if you change any python code
2:09 PM
changing template code generally doesn't require a restart
2:10 PM
i do: sudo /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
Noam Ben-Avi 2:10 PM
mike what exactly is sudo
2:10 PM
and is it cool if i do the sudo pull?
Mike Mintz 2:10 PM
sudo runs something as the root user
2:10 PM
no
Noam Ben-Avi 2:10 PM
oh kk
Mike Mintz 2:11 PM
you want to run it as www-data
2:11 PM
sudo -u USERNAME runs it as that user
Noam Ben-Avi 2:11 PM
thats what i meant
Mike Mintz 2:11 PM
yeah
Noam Ben-Avi 2:11 PM
is it clear for me to run sudo -u www-data git pull
Mike Mintz 2:11 PM
btw, if you ever forget a command, you can always try looking in my history: type sudo -u mike history
2:11 PM
you'll probably find it somewhere in there
2:11 PM
yes
Noam Ben-Avi 2:12 PM
nice so i did the pull and now it should have the event viewer?
Mike Mintz 2:12 PM
did you change a .py, or only .html?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:12 PM
only html
Mike Mintz 2:12 PM
yep, it should just be there then
Jimmy Tobin 2:12 PM
the history command doesn't work
Noam Ben-Avi 2:12 PM
if i do change .py then i need to migrate correct?
Mike Mintz 2:12 PM
oh, try this:

sudo su - mike (logs in as mike)
history (displays my history)
2:13 PM
then exit to get back to your account
2:13 PM
if you change.py, you'll want to restart apache: sudo /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
Chris Beachy 2:13 PM
that worked
Mike Mintz 2:13 PM
you may also want to do a migration, but only if you made any database schema changes
Chris Beachy 2:13 PM
how do you exit back to your account mike?
2:13 PM
i am in yorus
Mike Mintz 2:13 PM
(for example, adding a new item type or field)
2:13 PM
"exit"
2:13 PM
or ctrl-d
Jimmy Tobin 2:14 PM
noam we should have the fields labeled for the viewer
Noam Ben-Avi 2:14 PM
ok i can get on that
2:15 PM
nice now i know how to do these comits
2:15 PM
Jimmy if you want to sketch out how everything should look cause you are doing interface stuff
2:15 PM
and send it to me
2:15 PM
i can do that
Jimmy Tobin 2:15 PM
oh just for now add labels
Noam Ben-Avi 2:16 PM
kk how should that work for start date start time end time end date
Jimmy Tobin 2:16 PM
that's fine
2:16 PM
here's my event right now
2:16 PM
Great fun made

Jimmy's party

Jan. 1, 1991 2 a.m. 5 a.m. Feb. 1, 2001

Symsys!

To make great fun
2:16 PM
This message has been removed.
2:17 PM
This message has been removed.
2:17 PM
dammit
Noam Ben-Avi 2:17 PM
How should i add labels to Great fun made

Jimmy's party

Jan. 1, 1991 2 a.m. 5 a.m. Feb. 1, 2001

Symsys!

To make great fun
2:17 PM
i mean the middle part
2:17 PM
just jan 1, ect
Jimmy Tobin 2:18 PM
Description:Great fun made

title: Jimmy's party

Jan. 1, 1991 2 a.m. 5 a.m. Feb. 1, 2001

Location:Symsys!

purpose: To make great fun
Noam Ben-Avi 2:18 PM
oh and mike do u have time to talk about the diff stuff?
2:18 PM
Todd put that as a priority
2:18 PM
and sounds good jimmy i can do that
Mike Mintz 2:19 PM
yes
2:19 PM
was there any more generic deme stuff you wanted me to go over with everyone first though?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:20 PM
hmmm
2:20 PM
anyone?
2:20 PM
so im still a bit confused about html pages interacting with python
2:20 PM
in event viewer i did <p> {{event.name}}</p> to display the name
2:21 PM
im confused as to the double curly braces vs one curley brace
2:21 PM
but i know im embedding python into html
Mike Mintz 2:22 PM
yeah, so what you're using is the Django template format
2:22 PM
you can read up all about it on the django tutorial, but i'll explain the basics
2:22 PM
single curly braces shouldn't do anything
2:22 PM
double curly braces will just display the specified variable as a string
2:22 PM
{{ event.name }} just evaluates the the event.name value
2:22 PM
then there is {% .... %}
2:23 PM
those are django template commands, like {% ifequal event.name 'some name' %}
2:23 PM
those you have to consult the django documents on how they all work
2:23 PM
some of them are deme commands, and you'll find them in cms/templatetags/item_tags.py
2:23 PM
(or in other modules potentially)
2:23 PM
for example {% ifagentcan 'view Item.name' event %}
2:24 PM
it's important to make sure we always check permissions
Noam Ben-Avi 2:24 PM
ah kk
2:24 PM
hey jimmy i updated the labels
Jimmy Tobin 2:25 PM
looks great!
2:26 PM
i'll stylize it
Noam Ben-Avi 2:26 PM
its all under deme_django/modules/event/templates/event/show.html
Jimmy Tobin 2:26 PM
once i learn how...
2:26 PM
oki
Noam Ben-Avi 2:26 PM
so once u need to do css or whatever
Jimmy Tobin 2:26 PM
i do that in the views section right?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:26 PM
ull see it when u cd into modules
2:26 PM
there will be event
2:27 PM
and then when u cd into that templates and in that even and in that html.show
2:27 PM
its just a static html page
Jimmy Tobin 2:27 PM
oh oki
Noam Ben-Avi 2:27 PM
sry show.html
Jimmy Tobin 2:27 PM
templates
2:27 PM
i see
2:27 PM
oki
Noam Ben-Avi 2:28 PM
chris jimmy u guys have any general deme questions while mike is on?
Jimmy Tobin 2:29 PM
not at the moment but as the week goes on we'll ask more
Chris Beachy 2:29 PM
oh actually
2:30 PM
mike dyou know how i can get a copy of the code for the symsys website?
2:30 PM
todd wants me to try and run it on the new version of django to see if it breaks
Mike Mintz 2:30 PM
yeah, i just have to make you an account on symsys.stanford.edu
2:31 PM
okay try to login
2:31 PM
again your initial password is deme123
2:31 PM
make sure to change it
Chris Beachy 2:32 PM
i'm in
2:32 PM
now how do i get the code?
Mike Mintz 2:32 PM
it's in /var/www/symsys
2:33 PM
it's just another checkout of deme
Chris Beachy 2:33 PM
cool
2:33 PM
so i just do git pull from that directory?
Mike Mintz 2:33 PM
so you'll want to replace the django_src directory with the version according to the installation doc (1.2.5)
2:33 PM
and then, yeah, do a git pull and a migrate
2:33 PM
and apache restart
2:35 PM
noam: did you want to talk about diff viewer?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:36 PM
yeah
Mike Mintz 2:36 PM
so you saw my email, right?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:36 PM
yeah
2:36 PM
so for all fields except for the document
2:36 PM
we can pretty much just compare
2:36 PM
but for the body of the text that is more involved and u are proposing an open source solution right?
Mike Mintz 2:36 PM
yes
Noam Ben-Avi 2:36 PM
cool
2:37 PM
and this is all in action notices?
Mike Mintz 2:37 PM
for non-html text, it shouldn't be too bad (although people generally have much longer lines of prose than they do of code, so line vs line changes aren't as useful, althoguh i think mediawiki can do word-by-word changes)
2:37 PM
action notices and emails, but emails are always generated from a single action notice
2:37 PM
for html text, it'll be quite a feat
2:37 PM
i did a quick google search and found this: http://www.aaronsw.com/2002/diff/
Noam Ben-Avi 2:37 PM
ok so if we do it in action notices itll be ok for both right?
Mike Mintz 2:37 PM
but it was last updated in 2003, and who knows how good it is
2:38 PM
well, we only have to do the logic in one place
Noam Ben-Avi 2:38 PM
ok yeah thats what i meant
Mike Mintz 2:38 PM
but the presentation has to be done multiple times depending on how many different places we want to view it
2:38 PM
okay cyeah
Noam Ben-Avi 2:38 PM
this looks interesting
2:38 PM
so the pages are only html right?
2:38 PM
do you think this will suport embedded languages as well?
Mike Mintz 2:39 PM
HtmlDocument only has HTML in the body field
2:39 PM
for DjangoTempalteDocument, we'll just use the line-by-line or word-by-word diff that any other TextDocument uses
2:39 PM
it won't be a common case
Noam Ben-Avi 2:39 PM
ok sounds good
2:39 PM
so I guess my biggest hurdle
2:40 PM
is how to start on the deme site with changes
2:40 PM
joe showed us how to do an html viewer and thats about it, for more involved stuff like action viewer I am a little lost, but definetly know what needs to be done
2:40 PM
and know that every item inherets the fields like name, description, type... ect
Mike Mintz 2:41 PM
well action notices are kind of a special case since they aren't really items
2:42 PM
action notices, permissions, recursive memberships, recurisve comments, emails ---> all of these are not part of the item hierarchy and are treated specially
Noam Ben-Avi 2:42 PM
oh kk
2:42 PM
right i remember that from the documentation now
Mike Mintz 2:42 PM
so there is no such thing as an "actionnotice viewer", since at least as we've defined it, a "viewer" is for Item or a subclass
Noam Ben-Avi 2:43 PM
so right now an action notice will say the time when edited and where on the site and who did it
Mike Mintz 2:43 PM
well let's go to cms/models.py
Noam Ben-Avi 2:43 PM
kk
2:43 PM
do u think this would be better done
2:43 PM
with a shared screen so i can follow you? or I think everyone would benifit from seeing htis
Chris Beachy 2:43 PM
yes yes plese
Mike Mintz 2:44 PM
sure
2:44 PM
can we do shared screen with multiple people?
Chris Beachy 2:44 PM
hopefully
Mike Mintz 2:44 PM
or should we do VNC
Noam Ben-Avi 2:44 PM
on skype i think you can do multiple video in one chat, and then there is a button for sharing screens, i just saw someone do that recently
Chris Beachy 2:45 PM
yeah try pressing the button mike
Mike Mintz 2:45 PM
button?
Chris Beachy 2:45 PM
top right
Mike Mintz 2:45 PM
top right is "Leave Chat"
2:45 PM
nice try
2:46 PM
i'm on the linux version, things are different
Noam Ben-Avi 2:46 PM
i think he is refering to the button with a square and arrow
Mike Mintz 2:46 PM
and it's quite possible it won't work, since i couldn't get it to make a phone call
2:53 PM
hey
trbdavies 2:54 PM
I'm back, just read through the chat a bit. Does Skype chat create logs?
Mike Mintz 2:54 PM
i guess the vnc is not working..
2:54 PM
maybe your IP isn't public, or they have a firewall
Chris Beachy 2:55 PM
hmm ok
Mike Mintz 2:55 PM
my chat has a history
2:55 PM
chris, i'll give you a command to run...
Chris Beachy 2:55 PM
ok
Mike Mintz 2:56 PM
try ssh cbeachy@deme.stanford.edu -R 5910:localhost:5900 -N
2:56 PM
and enter your deme password
2:56 PM
wait
2:56 PM
instead: ssh cbeachy@deme.stanford.edu -R 5900:localhost:5900 -N
2:56 PM
then we can all vnc to deme.stanford.edu, and it will get redirected to your computer
Chris Beachy 2:57 PM
it's taking a while..
Noam Ben-Avi 2:57 PM
how do we vnc to deme.stanford.edu?
Mike Mintz 2:57 PM
hmmm that probably has a firewall too
2:57 PM
i hate firewalls
Chris Beachy 2:58 PM
not even sure what they are
2:58 PM
but they really suck
Mike Mintz 2:58 PM
haha yeah
Noam Ben-Avi 2:58 PM
hahaha yup
Mike Mintz 2:58 PM
noam what kind of internet do you have right now?
2:58 PM
are you behind a wireless router?
Noam Ben-Avi 2:58 PM
yup
Mike Mintz 2:58 PM
arg
Noam Ben-Avi 2:58 PM
i have a feeling my house is riddled with firewalls
Chris Beachy 2:58 PM
what is a firewall exactly?
Mike Mintz 2:59 PM
it prevents us from connecting to certain (or all ports)
2:59 PM
on deme, i think there's a firewall for everything except port 22 (ssh)
2:59 PM
and then, if you're behind a wireless router (except at stanford), you have a private IP so you cannot accept incoming connections without reconfiguring the router
3:00 PM
maybe it'll work on a myth machine...
Chris Beachy 3:00 PM
i could ssh into myth
Mike Mintz 3:00 PM
no it's doing the same thing
Chris Beachy 3:01 PM
ok. if this is all just to use vnc then maybe you and noam can just have a 2 way skype? jimmy just left
Noam Ben-Avi 3:01 PM
http://www.mikogo.com/
3:01 PM
this is probably useful for the future
Chris Beachy 3:02 PM
brb
Noam Ben-Avi 3:02 PM
if we cant get it working on myth because i think we will probably be using screen sharing a bit
Mike Mintz 3:02 PM
we can request them to open the port on the firewall for the future
3:02 PM
Todd: do you know who to talk to about that?
trbdavies 3:03 PM
I think I'd just submit a HelpSU ticket
Mike Mintz 3:03 PM
oh this could just be me not being in the stanford network
3:04 PM
can you try:

telnet deme.stanford.edu 5900
3:04 PM
see if it just is "waiting" or if it does connection refused
3:04 PM
(Chris or Todd since you must be in the stanford network)
Noam Ben-Avi 3:04 PM
should i do that in terminal? oh ok
Mike Mintz 3:04 PM
Noam and I can get a VPN if we need to
3:05 PM
probably better than allowing any hacker to find our VNC session
Noam Ben-Avi 3:05 PM
whats exactly a vpn?
trbdavies 3:05 PM
telnet deme.stanford.edu 5900 looks like it just hangs
Mike Mintz 3:05 PM
it lets our computer pretend to be on the Stanford network even though we're remote
3:05 PM
by using some authentication
3:05 PM
okay, so the firewall is probably internal as well
trbdavies 3:06 PM
DN0a2009c4:~ symbolicsystems$ telnet deme.stanford.edu 5900
Trying 171.64.42.154...
telnet: connect to address 171.64.42.154: Operation timed out
telnet: Unable to connect to remote host
3:06 PM
I'm in my office
Mike Mintz 3:07 PM
yeah that's what i get as well
3:07 PM
oh wait, chris might need to run that command again though
Chris Beachy 3:09 PM
hey i'm back
Mike Mintz 3:09 PM
hey
3:09 PM
i'm trying it with myth
3:11 PM
can you try: telnet myth1.stanford.edu 59595
3:11 PM
sorry try again
3:11 PM
chris or todd
Chris Beachy 3:12 PM
todd you got it?
Mike Mintz 3:12 PM
it'll either be immediate fail/success, or trying...
Chris Beachy 3:12 PM
refused
3:12 PM

Mike Mintz 3:12 PM
immediate?
Chris Beachy 3:12 PM
yep
Mike Mintz 3:12 PM
oh good
3:12 PM
okay now let's see if i can do better...
Chris Beachy 3:12 PM
Trying 171.64.15.7...
telnet: connect to address 171.64.15.7: Connection refused
telnet: Unable to connect to remote host
Mike Mintz 3:13 PM
try again?
Chris Beachy 3:13 PM
does the telnet command just tell you if you can connect to the specified port?
Mike Mintz 3:13 PM
basically
3:13 PM
you can also use it to type and receive things
3:13 PM
but what you said is how i'm using it
Chris Beachy 3:13 PM
failed again
Mike Mintz 3:13 PM
how about now?
Chris Beachy 3:14 PM
failed
Mike Mintz 3:14 PM
hmph
Chris Beachy 3:14 PM
how are you changing it?
Mike Mintz 3:14 PM
i'm trying to forward myth1:59595 to my computer
Chris Beachy 3:14 PM
ok i see
Mike Mintz 3:14 PM
one more timE?
Chris Beachy 3:15 PM
nope
Mike Mintz 3:15 PM
oh well
3:16 PM
i think the simplest thing would be to request the firewall to be open for whichever computers we want to be able to share
trbdavies 3:16 PM
Is it really necessary? I'm worried "they" won't want to do this.
3:17 PM
No other way?
Noam Ben-Avi 3:17 PM
screen sharing would be immensly helpful especially for collaberation between me jimmy and chris
Mike Mintz 3:17 PM
well the options i can see are VNC, skype, the software noam mentioned, or something else
3:17 PM
skype only allows 2 people at once
3:17 PM
VNC requires an open port
trbdavies 3:17 PM
does Firewall disable all screen sharing or just VNC?
Mike Mintz 3:17 PM
the software noam mentioned doesn't seem to have a linux option
Chris Beachy 3:18 PM
i think just vnc
Mike Mintz 3:18 PM
it disables decentralized screen sharing
3:18 PM
screen sharing via skype's servers are fine since it's outgoing connection
3:18 PM
VNC is decentralized
trbdavies 3:18 PM
I see
Mike Mintz 3:19 PM
or maybe noam, that site you gave us doesn't require downloading it?
3:19 PM
i just noticed the download page only had windows and mac
Noam Ben-Avi 3:20 PM
hmmmm im looking into it
3:22 PM
http://www.yuuguu.com/home how does this look?
Mike Mintz 3:23 PM
it costs $80/person i think
Noam Ben-Avi 3:23 PM
theres a 7 day free trial
Mike Mintz 3:24 PM
but it does claim to support linux
Noam Ben-Avi 3:24 PM
yeah, which could be good until the ports open
3:24 PM
and i feel like this week will require some colaberation
Mike Mintz 3:24 PM
oh actually, i think only one person needs the software
3:24 PM
the other people can watch with flash
Chris Beachy 3:24 PM
ooh nice
3:25 PM
how do we plan to open the ports in the meantime?
trbdavies 3:25 PM
We can pay for it, no problem, if that's the best option
3:26 PM
I need to know precisely what to ask HelpSU
Noam Ben-Avi 3:26 PM
we only need one membership anyway right?
Mike Mintz 3:26 PM
i think so
3:29 PM
for VNC, we would say "We would like to be able to use deme.stanford.edu ssh port forwarding to collaborate over VNC as some of our team is remote. Could you please open a few ports to access (including outside the stanford network), say 59230-59240?"
trbdavies 3:30 PM
okay I'll submit it
Mike Mintz 3:30 PM
thanks
Chris Beachy 3:31 PM
hey mike at some point, maybe once we have screen sharing going, could you walk me through the best way to update the django verison of the sym sys website?
Mike Mintz 3:31 PM
sure
Chris Beachy 3:31 PM
cool thanks man
Mike Mintz 3:32 PM
we could just do 2-way over skype, or if Noam wants to watch as well, we could try that software yuuguu
Noam Ben-Avi 3:32 PM
hahah well I would like to see everything but if its pressing then i could sit out
3:32 PM
but i would def like to know how to as well
Mike Mintz 3:33 PM
chris do you want to try that software?
Noam Ben-Avi 3:33 PM
like how to take from different repositories
Chris Beachy 3:33 PM
yeah sure
Noam Ben-Avi 3:33 PM
just a heads up i need to leave at 8 my time, 5 california time
Mike Mintz 3:33 PM
okay
3:34 PM
chris see if you can get it to work, and let us know the "conference pin" and noam and i will try to connect
Noam Ben-Avi 3:34 PM
brb
Chris Beachy 3:35 PM
downloading yuugu
3:35 PM
now
Mike Mintz 3:35 PM
great
trbdavies 3:35 PM
HelpSU is submitted
Mike Mintz 3:35 PM
thanks todd
3:35 PM
noam: i think we'll go here: http://www.yuuguu.com/share
Chris Beachy 3:37 PM
heres the pin for that website
3:37 PM
479167
3:37 PM
try and join guise
Mike Mintz 3:38 PM
cool i see it!
Chris Beachy 3:39 PM
but i guess there's no way for you to share your screen?
Noam Ben-Avi 3:39 PM
back
3:40 PM
whoa cool
Mike Mintz 3:40 PM
not simultaneously i don't think
Chris Beachy 3:41 PM
ok so should we start walkin through it?
Mike Mintz 3:41 PM
yeah
3:42 PM
so let's ssh to symsys.stanford.edu
Chris Beachy 3:42 PM
yup
Mike Mintz 3:42 PM
sorry let me move my windows around
Noam Ben-Avi 3:43 PM
Mike are you controling that?
Mike Mintz 3:43 PM
not intentionally
Chris Beachy 3:43 PM
i was just movin my screen around, enlarging terminal
Noam Ben-Avi 3:43 PM
ah kk, this thing has remote access features so actually any of us could be working on this right now
3:44 PM
which is pretty neat
Chris Beachy 3:44 PM
haha WOOAAAAA
3:44 PM
thats so intense
3:44 PM
you could hack me right nowww
Mike Mintz 3:44 PM
okay so here we are
3:46 PM
my enter key isn't doing anything
3:46 PM
actually how about i don't control
3:46 PM
i'll just explain and watch
Chris Beachy 3:46 PM
ok
3:46 PM
can you still control right now?
3:46 PM
or did i override you
Mike Mintz 3:47 PM
i released control before
Chris Beachy 3:47 PM
ok
3:47 PM
so waats the first step?
Mike Mintz 3:47 PM
first we'll get the right version of django
3:47 PM
unfortunately i may have installed it multiple times
3:48 PM
but there's at least one version in django_src right here
3:48 PM
so type: svn info django_src
3:48 PM
it'll probably be like trunk -r 9973
Chris Beachy 3:48 PM
takin a while..
3:48 PM
as you can see
3:48 PM
haha
Mike Mintz 3:48 PM
we'll want to replace it with http://code.djangoproject.com/svn/django/tags/releases/1.2.5
3:48 PM
oh it's 1.1
3:48 PM
but we still need 1.2
3:49 PM
so cd to that directory
3:49 PM
and try this (might not work);
3:49 PM
sudo -u www-data svn switch http://code.djangoproject.com/svn/django/tags/releases/1.2.5
3:49 PM
that will switch the remote repository to the 1.2.5 one
3:49 PM
yep
3:49 PM
oh my bad
3:49 PM
let me add you
3:50 PM
i added you on deme but not symsys
Chris Beachy 3:50 PM
for sure
3:50 PM
for shore
Mike Mintz 3:50 PM
this server is slow...
3:50 PM
i think the way the virtualization was done isn't very good
3:50 PM
okay try now
3:50 PM
you should have sudo
Chris Beachy 3:51 PM
fingers crossed
Mike Mintz 3:51 PM
looks good so far
3:51 PM
one time i did an svn switch and it got all messed up
3:52 PM
so i just deleted it and checked it out from scratch, no problems then
Chris Beachy 3:52 PM
what exactly is the switch doing?
3:52 PM
trading out djangos?
3:52 PM
nice it worked
Mike Mintz 3:53 PM
yep
3:53 PM
but now we have to update deme
3:53 PM
since it's incompatible
3:53 PM
let's go to the deme_django directory
3:53 PM
do a git pull (as www-data user)
Chris Beachy 3:53 PM
so sudo www-data git pull?
Mike Mintz 3:54 PM
sudo -u www-data git pull
3:55 PM
okay, this is my bad
3:55 PM
i made some changes to item_tags and did not commit them, since they are symsys specific
3:55 PM
(basically a hack to prevent item 6 from slowing down the entire site when it gets crawled)
3:55 PM
at least i thin
3:55 PM
type git diff
3:56 PM
okay so i added caching only on symsys
3:56 PM
scroll down
3:56 PM
okay there it is
3:56 PM
if viewable_items.count() > 500... not display
3:57 PM
the other changse at the top were able to get merged
3:57 PM
i guess we could just commit the change
3:57 PM
deal with the fact that it's kind of a hack later
Chris Beachy 3:57 PM
sure
Mike Mintz 3:58 PM
unfortunately i'm not sure we can commit from here
3:58 PM
oh wait, we can, just not as www-data
3:58 PM
but www-data owns the .git folder
Chris Beachy 3:58 PM
what exactly is ww data?
3:58 PM
why do we sudo from it
Mike Mintz 3:58 PM
the apache user
3:58 PM
we only want to run the site as the apache user
3:58 PM
never as root
3:58 PM
less security issues
Chris Beachy 3:58 PM
hmm
Mike Mintz 3:58 PM
let me see if i can get it to commit
3:58 PM
i'm going to log in from my machine
Chris Beachy 3:59 PM
hokay
Mike Mintz 3:59 PM
(in the future, we shouldn't be making changes on the server, i was just desperate since things were breaking and we needed it to get working)
Chris Beachy 4:00 PM
so in general whenever we want to push or pull
4:00 PM
do we do it from www-data
Mike Mintz 4:01 PM
yes exactly
4:01 PM
the only problem is, it doesn't have an ssh key that github recognizes
4:01 PM
so i'm going to try and do it with my ssh key
Chris Beachy 4:02 PM
here is another basic quesit
4:02 PM
quesition
4:02 PM
what exactly is happening when you ssh somewhere, and why do you need an ssh key?
Mike Mintz 4:03 PM
you can either authenticate with a password or with public/private key cryptography
4:03 PM
the latter is much more secure
4:03 PM
github only allows the latter (to my knowledge)
Noam Ben-Avi 4:03 PM
Hey mike, I have been working since 9 am my time in new york, and am feeling super woozy from looking at a screen so long/ not eating, is it ok if we go through all the diff stuff tmrw?
Mike Mintz 4:04 PM
yeah, no worries
Noam Ben-Avi 4:04 PM
awesome, Mike your the man thanks for showing us so much so fast
Chris Beachy 4:04 PM
yeah thanks so much mike
Noam Ben-Avi 4:05 PM
any specific time u want to meet?
4:05 PM
ill be working since 9 am my time
4:05 PM
and ill start looking for good open source html diff showers
4:05 PM
but for text we are set right?
4:05 PM
like plain text?
trbdavies 4:05 PM
Mike, earlier we (all but you) agreed on 11 am PDT Wednesdays for Weekly voice meetings. Does that work for you? I'm not sure how we can do it with two remote people though.
Mike Mintz 4:06 PM
yes that time is good
4:06 PM
conference call?
4:07 PM
yeah text should be easy, we'll still need to find a good viewer
trbdavies 4:07 PM
yes that works. We can do it through freeconferencecall and actually get a recording if we want
Mike Mintz 4:07 PM
i mean diff shower
Noam Ben-Avi 4:07 PM
ok im on it
trbdavies 4:07 PM
show-er, right
4:08 PM
I shower in diffs every morning. refreshing
Mike Mintz 4:08 PM
yes, show-er
Noam Ben-Avi 4:08 PM
hahaha ok I will see/hear you guys soon!
4:08 PM
have a great day
4:08 PM
everyone
trbdavies 4:09 PM
so long noam
Noam Ben-Avi 4:09 PM
oh todd
4:09 PM
is old code up yet?
Mike Mintz 4:09 PM
okay noam, can we meet 11am PDT tomorrow?
4:09 PM
10am for me
Noam Ben-Avi 4:09 PM
PDT is california right?
Chris Beachy 4:10 PM
yup
Noam Ben-Avi 4:10 PM
yeah sounds good
4:10 PM
ill be on well before that doing research into diff view-ers
4:10 PM
so whenever you are around i will be on too
trbdavies 4:10 PM
yes, check out the deme history links page http://deme.stanford.edu/viewing/htmldocument/40 under PHP Deme Websites. Look at both v0.5 and v0.6. Latter requires you create an account, and document viewing hangs, but the Javascript interface is good. Due to Ben Newman, now at Mozilla.
Noam Ben-Avi 4:11 PM
nice
4:11 PM
will look at that too
trbdavies 4:11 PM
PDT is cali
Noam Ben-Avi 4:11 PM
bye guys! have a great day
Chris Beachy 4:11 PM
buy naomsm
Mike Mintz 4:11 PM
gnight noam
4:11 PM
chris: still trying to fix the git for symsys..
4:12 PM
okay it looks good now
4:12 PM
let's go back to the console
4:12 PM
(i just had to make the changes manually on my local machine, push them, so it was in sync, and then git pull worked on symsys)
Chris Beachy 4:12 PM
ok
4:12 PM
so same command?
Mike Mintz 4:13 PM
well yeah, but i just ran it so nothing will happen
4:13 PM
but do it just in case
Chris Beachy 4:13 PM
yep
Mike Mintz 4:14 PM
are you still sharing your screen?
4:14 PM
i think it hasn't changed
Chris Beachy 4:14 PM
yeah still sahring
4:14 PM
you can see it?
Mike Mintz 4:15 PM
i mean, i see an old chat window
4:15 PM
says "show-er right"
Chris Beachy 4:15 PM
ok shall i refresh it
Mike Mintz 4:16 PM
now it works
Chris Beachy 4:16 PM
did you get a new screen request
4:16 PM
ok coo
Mike Mintz 4:16 PM
okay so you did git pull
Chris Beachy 4:16 PM
yes
Mike Mintz 4:16 PM
now you should do a migrate
4:16 PM
sudo -u www-data ./manage.py migrate
Chris Beachy 4:16 PM
what does that do again?
Mike Mintz 4:17 PM
that should update the database schema for any changes we made
4:17 PM
like adding fields to Item
4:17 PM
okay so i think maybe we have an old version of South ( the migration software)
4:17 PM
yeah we do
4:17 PM
let me see how to update that...
4:17 PM
sudo easy_install -U South
4:18 PM
okay, you shouldn't have to do that again
4:18 PM
that was just because i had updated some things
4:18 PM
now try the migrate command
4:19 PM
yes!
Chris Beachy 4:19 PM
nicee
Mike Mintz 4:19 PM
(that is the most scary part, since it messes with actual database data)
4:19 PM
okay remember what's last?
Chris Beachy 4:19 PM
hmm
4:19 PM
pull a copy on my computer?
Mike Mintz 4:19 PM
nope
4:19 PM
apache restart
Chris Beachy 4:19 PM
oh right
4:20 PM
sudo /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
4:20 PM
is that the command?
Mike Mintz 4:20 PM
yes
4:20 PM
and then the last step that i didn't even mention
4:20 PM
see if it works
4:20 PM
the cynical side of me knows it almost always doesn't work the first time
4:21 PM
especially since we haven't updated in a while
4:21 PM
go to the home page
4:21 PM
and do shift-refresh
4:21 PM
just to make sure it's not cached
4:21 PM
just in case, go to a less commonly viewed page
4:21 PM
as i now remember symsys does caching as well
4:22 PM
say, some random Membership
4:22 PM
but it does look promising
4:22 PM
or unless it's still loading
4:22 PM
i can't tell
Chris Beachy 4:22 PM
still loading]
Mike Mintz 4:23 PM
i ran "top" on symsys, it's spinning CPU, so i guess that's a good sign
4:23 PM
(as opposed to just hanging on your end)
Chris Beachy 4:23 PM
so its just hanging in general?
4:24 PM
ooh mine loaded
Mike Mintz 4:24 PM
i think it was just slow at first since it had to load everything back into memory after the rstart
Chris Beachy 4:24 PM
wow
4:24 PM
so its running on the new django now huh
Mike Mintz 4:24 PM
okay, here's how we confirm it actually did something
4:24 PM
let's think of a change we made since it was last updated
Chris Beachy 4:25 PM
event viewer
Mike Mintz 4:25 PM
oh yeah
Chris Beachy 4:25 PM
oh that was deme
Mike Mintz 4:25 PM
it's all deme
Chris Beachy 4:25 PM
haha ok
4:25 PM
i'm pretty sure jimmy's party was an event
Mike Mintz 4:25 PM
oh, sorry
4:25 PM
different database, same software
4:25 PM
just find an arbitrary event
4:26 PM
event is a subclass of Document i believe
4:26 PM
so go to Documents
4:26 PM
or just go to the ..
4:26 PM
where is the items button?
Chris Beachy 4:26 PM
not sure
4:26 PM
going back to the home
Mike Mintz 4:26 PM
okay
trbdavies 4:26 PM
need to log in
4:27 PM
anonymous request of calendar is hanging
4:28 PM
now it loaded after about a minute
Chris Beachy 4:28 PM
hmm
4:28 PM
it doesn't let me log in as my deme account
Mike Mintz 4:28 PM
that's probably on deme.stanford.edu database
4:28 PM
do you have a symsys account?
Chris Beachy 4:28 PM
yes
4:29 PM
does this have any significance mike?
4:29 PM
the error
Mike Mintz 4:29 PM
yes, we don't have SSL working
4:29 PM
so webauth doesn't work
Chris Beachy 4:29 PM
ok
trbdavies 4:29 PM
I see Noam's event viewer
Mike Mintz 4:29 PM
if you just go to http://symsys.stanford.edu/viewing/event you can see all the events
trbdavies 4:30 PM
Just loaded the calendar again.Took about 15 sec this time
Chris Beachy 4:30 PM
yeah it looks like noams event viewer
4:31 PM
was there one before noam even?
trbdavies 4:31 PM
I think it was just a generic viewer that put fields on the screen in alphabetical order or something
Mike Mintz 4:32 PM
okay, well i think in terms of updating, we're good
4:32 PM
was that all you needed to do for now?
Chris Beachy 4:32 PM
yeah i think so right todd?
trbdavies 4:32 PM
I'm concerned about the slow calendar load
Chris Beachy 4:33 PM
the whole site has been slow for me
Mike Mintz 4:33 PM
yes
4:33 PM
i believe the virtualization is a big part of the problem
Chris Beachy 4:33 PM
ok probably
trbdavies 4:33 PM
makes sense
Mike Mintz 4:33 PM
i noticed a file transfer from myth to symsyshoster was like 5MB/s, vs from deme to myth was like 100KB/s
4:34 PM
haha, okay i left the screen share
Chris Beachy 4:34 PM
haha thanks mike
Mike Mintz 4:34 PM
you can turn it off, we'll come back next time we have to do something together
Chris Beachy 4:35 PM
ok cool
4:35 PM
hey mike i still have a lot of little clarifying questions about lots of stuff
4:35 PM
but it can totally wait
4:35 PM
if you are trying to do other things
Mike Mintz 4:35 PM
if you have it now, you can ask
4:35 PM
let me just get a snack 1min
Chris Beachy 4:38 PM
wil also be back in 1 min
Mike Mintz 4:38 PM
back
Chris Beachy 4:38 PM
oh ok nvm
4:38 PM
still here
4:38 PM
so my questoin was about git push and pull
4:38 PM
I understand you push stuff from your local copy into the global one
4:39 PM
but what does pull do?
Mike Mintz 4:39 PM
pulls from the global one into the local one
Chris Beachy 4:39 PM
what if you didn't have a local one?
4:39 PM
would you make a new on
Mike Mintz 4:39 PM
you always have a local one
4:39 PM
you either have to "git init" to make a blank one, or "git clone" to copy an existing one
Chris Beachy 4:39 PM
oh ok
4:39 PM
and i did that for deme and sym sys earlier huh
4:39 PM
i see
Mike Mintz 4:39 PM
have you used svn?
Chris Beachy 4:40 PM
yes
Mike Mintz 4:40 PM
yeah you did git clone
Chris Beachy 4:40 PM
a lil bit
Mike Mintz 4:40 PM
okay, so it's like SVN, except with some intermediate steps
4:40 PM
in SVN, you have "local files (tracked and untracked)" and "remote repository"
4:41 PM
in Git, you have "local files", "staged updates", "local repository" and "remote repository"
Chris Beachy 4:41 PM
and you will only push from your local
4:41 PM
and pull from the remote repository?
Mike Mintz 4:41 PM
yes, push is from local repo to remote repo
4:41 PM
pull is from remote repo to local repo
4:41 PM
add is from local files to staged updates
4:41 PM
commit is from staged updates to local repo
Chris Beachy 4:42 PM
so does it matter which directory you're in when you issue the git command?
Mike Mintz 4:42 PM
only if you specify a filename (like for git add)
4:42 PM
otherwise as long as you're in the base dir or a subdir, you're fine i believe
Chris Beachy 4:42 PM
ok cool. thanks!
4:43 PM
my other question was just about ssh ing and what exactly is going on there
4:43 PM
because I do it all the time but never fully understood it
Mike Mintz 4:44 PM
ssh stands for "secure shell", it's a secure connection from a client (you) to a remote machine (deme.stanford.edu) and gives you shell access
4:44 PM
there used to be telnet, which was the same thing, but not secure (unencrypted)
4:44 PM
you can also use the same protocol to copy files from one machien to another, with the scp command
4:44 PM
(vs rcp which was unencrypted)
4:44 PM
git can run over many different protocols, including ssh, and https
4:45 PM
or were you more curious about what the shell is in general?
Chris Beachy 4:45 PM
kinda more in general
Mike Mintz 4:45 PM
okay, so let me know if anything i'm saying is too basic or advanced
4:46 PM
you start out in a "terminal emulator". it used to be all computers were terminals with a 80x20 character screen and a keyboard and that's it
4:46 PM
or something like that
4:46 PM
you open Terminal on your mac, or xterm on a linux machine, or cmd.exe on windows, and it emulates a terminal
4:47 PM
it can run any program, and take keyboard input and display a monospace text output
4:47 PM
but it always has to choose a program to start with
4:47 PM
in the vast majority of cases, it will start with a "shell" such as "bash" (which I think mac uses now)
Chris Beachy 4:47 PM
same
Mike Mintz 4:48 PM
the shell is basically just a launcher, but it also has a built-in programming language
4:48 PM
if you type a command, it'll just run, and when the command exits, it goes back to the shell
4:48 PM
for example, ls is a command
4:48 PM
if you type "which ls" you'll see it's located in /bin/ls
4:48 PM
if you open /bin/ls in a decompiler, you'll see it's just a bunch of assembly
4:49 PM
actually ls is a program, not a command
4:49 PM
when you tyupe something in, it might be a "shell command" like "exit" or "cd"
4:49 PM
but it might be a program, and it looks for programs in /bin and /usr/bin
4:49 PM
if you type echo $PATH
4:49 PM
you'll see a list of places it searches for programs
4:49 PM
echo is a shell command
4:49 PM
$PATH is a shell variable
4:49 PM
you can write entire programs in bash scripting
4:49 PM
in fact, there are probably some .sh files in the deme repository
4:49 PM
like reset_db.sh
4:50 PM
if you run ./manage.py, it's executing the program manage.py (you gave it the full path to it)
4:50 PM
. is the current directory
4:50 PM
at the top of manage.py, it has some text about how to interpret the code
4:50 PM
since it's not in assembly, it says it's a python program
Chris Beachy 4:51 PM
ok thats very enlightening!
Mike Mintz 4:51 PM
here's an official explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_(computing)
4:52 PM
i guess technically we're talking about a CLI shell (command line interface)
4:52 PM
windows is really a GUI shell
4:52 PM
in fact, windows 3.1 was merely a shell that ran on top of DOS
Chris Beachy 4:52 PM
i guess my original question was more about how we are able to inhabit some other systems memory so easily with ssh
Mike Mintz 4:52 PM
ooo
4:52 PM
well, do you know anything about sockets?
Chris Beachy 4:52 PM
haha nope
Mike Mintz 4:53 PM
so the internet is like a stack
4:53 PM
on the bottom is Ethernet or whatever transmitting 0s and 1s
4:53 PM
but on top of that are a few layers that define those 0s and 1s and what they mean
4:53 PM
in TCP/IP layer, you can open a virtual connection from one machine to another
4:53 PM
that just means it's an isolated stream of 0s and 1s from one computer to another, in a specific program
4:54 PM
the SSH daemon runs on the host machine, and the SSH client runs on your machine
4:54 PM
they open a connection, and can just talk in 0s and 1s
4:54 PM
all it really takes is for everything your keyboard types to get sent from you to it
4:54 PM
and SSH daemon launches a "shell" underneath, pipes your input to the shell, and pipes the output of the shell back over the connection to you
Chris Beachy 4:54 PM
ok i see
Mike Mintz 4:54 PM
think of it like VNC or screen sharing for the shell
4:54 PM
but much simpler of course, since it's just letters
Chris Beachy 4:55 PM
and you couldn't establish that kind of connection without ssh?
Mike Mintz 4:55 PM
and it has advanced cryptography
4:55 PM
telnet is the way to do it without cryptography
4:55 PM
anyone could write a new program to do it
4:55 PM
ssh is just standard practice
4:55 PM
if you're curious, i can show you how to write sonmething like that in python
4:56 PM
it's literally like 10 lines of code on each side to establish that connection
Chris Beachy 4:56 PM
yeah that 'd be cool to know
Mike Mintz 4:56 PM
http://ilab.cs.byu.edu/python/socket/echoserver.html
4:56 PM
that's a server that anything you type to it, it sends back to you
4:56 PM
you could modify it so it reverses it and sends it back or whatever
Chris Beachy 4:56 PM
i was more curious about just how easy it would be to hack from just one side
Mike Mintz 4:56 PM
well you'd need the password and/or private key
4:57 PM
in your case, probably just the password
4:57 PM
it's pretty much impossible to hack without that, and brute forcing would take far too long
4:57 PM
especially since it throttles invalid password attempts
Chris Beachy 4:57 PM
yeah definitely
4:58 PM
ok cool tahnks man!
Mike Mintz 4:58 PM
no problem
Chris Beachy 4:58 PM
these are just questions that are cropping up
4:58 PM
i'm sure i will have a lot throughout the summa
Mike Mintz 4:58 PM
yeah you can ask anytime
4:58 PM
or email me if i'm not online
Chris Beachy 4:59 PM
awesome
Mike Mintz 4:59 PM
okay i have to go make some calls
4:59 PM
i'll stay in the room and be back periodically if you have more questions
Chris Beachy 4:59 PM
ok cool
4:59 PM
cya later, going to watch some python lectures
Mike Mintz 4:59 PM
see ya chris
trbdavies 5:05 PM
I think my version of Skype doesn't have the history option. I can't turn it on in preferences. Can someone save and post this as a file doc on Deme Team folio?
Chris Beachy 5:05 PM
yeah sure.
5:06 PM
how far back should i go? it extends quite a while
trbdavies 5:08 PM
Also I posted an email about the trip to CMU tomorrow at moffat field. I'm giving a talk on Deme. It's also streaming and has guest access. http://www.cmu.edu/silicon-valley/news-events/seminars/index.html. Chris and Jimmy if you want to come with me we need to leave at 11:30 so we can meet them for lunch with Ted Selker (big HCI dude). We'll be back by 3:30 I think.
5:09 PM
Chris - the beginning I guess.
5:09 PM
or whatever you think is a useful starting point.
Chris Beachy 5:10 PM
ok, they were all pretty basic questions but i found ity all very interesting
5:10 PM
well maybe not basic, but not entirely related to deme
trbdavies 5:10 PM
okay, it's all good.
Chris Beachy 5:15 PM
hey todd, i put the conversation on deme. It's called "Mike and Chris's Deep Conversation"